Stock vs. N1TC Needle
#11
10-27-2006, 02:09 AM
RE: Stock vs. N1TC Needle
ORIGINAL: Iowaguy
I think you would be best suited to throw away the stock needle. Putting in the 250R needle is nuts to me since it's over a decade old and the N1TC needle is the bomb, they don't charge $18 for it because it's junk. They know people want it. Put it back in, install a 128 main. Put the needle on the 2nd slot from top. Also, with a KN filter and hi-flow snorkel you may need an even larger main jet since it is getting tons of air, and having such a small main jet isn't giving it enough fuel evidently for low/mid acceleration. Maybe the reason your top end is okay is because it's taking such a long time to get the fuel in the carb and by the time you've accelerated to higher rpms it is just then getting the fuel to stretch it's legs. I don't know, i'm just guessing here. But I would definitely keep with the N1TC, going backwards on this bike is to me the wrong thing to do. Also, with that many miles have you checked your valve clearances? Just a thought.
I think you would be best suited to throw away the stock needle. Putting in the 250R needle is nuts to me since it's over a decade old and the N1TC needle is the bomb, they don't charge $18 for it because it's junk. They know people want it. Put it back in, install a 128 main. Put the needle on the 2nd slot from top. Also, with a KN filter and hi-flow snorkel you may need an even larger main jet since it is getting tons of air, and having such a small main jet isn't giving it enough fuel evidently for low/mid acceleration. Maybe the reason your top end is okay is because it's taking such a long time to get the fuel in the carb and by the time you've accelerated to higher rpms it is just then getting the fuel to stretch it's legs. I don't know, i'm just guessing here. But I would definitely keep with the N1TC, going backwards on this bike is to me the wrong thing to do. Also, with that many miles have you checked your valve clearances? Just a thought.
#12
10-27-2006, 02:29 AM
RE: Stock vs. N1TC Needle
Gents next time you ride, do me this favor. In third gear hold 8500-9000 rpm and let me know if the bike acts lean. Put the 128/raised stock needle and got same effcts as the 125@2and3. I'm putting the N1TC @3 in shortly and hope that helps the 'no load' high rpm lean. I think the cold weather has drasticly change things. I know how to set up jetting, main first(too max power), needle for mid range, and pilot for just off idle. I think the 128 main is the right jet for my set up, I just didn't want to raise the needle too high if there is another prefered needle. More to come........and thank for the feedback.
#13
10-27-2006, 03:25 AM
RE: Stock vs. N1TC Needle
Bad Bear posted a photo of his Dynojet needed and it's profile might be more what you are looking for. It did not taper smoothly, but dropped from fat to narrow within the span of 1/4 inch or so - very aggressive taper on that needle. Search for "dynojet" by Bad Bear and you'll probably find it - was July or August I think.
But what you describe is similar to what I felt before I changed my CVK settings. Previously, I had #35 pilot, #125 main, N1TC needle @ 2nd clip, fuel screw 2.5 turns out. I noticed what I'd describe as a stuttering - sputtering, not sure the proper turn at low to mid-range throttle settings. But when I opened the throttle, there was no hesitation or bog it just took off like a rocket like you describe. I'm not sure if I was correct, but I thought I might be a bit lean there as this seemed to start after I installed the 300cc bore. But it wasn't horrible and mostly I didn't even notice it but it was definitely there.
My current settings seemed to have solved that problem, but I'm also at 331cc now - I don't know how much that changed they dynamics. My current settings are: #35 pilot, #130 main, N1TC needle @ 3rd clip, fuel screw at 2.0 turns out. I've not had it up over 7K but from 2000 to 7000 RPM all seems well for me with this setup.
But what you describe is similar to what I felt before I changed my CVK settings. Previously, I had #35 pilot, #125 main, N1TC needle @ 2nd clip, fuel screw 2.5 turns out. I noticed what I'd describe as a stuttering - sputtering, not sure the proper turn at low to mid-range throttle settings. But when I opened the throttle, there was no hesitation or bog it just took off like a rocket like you describe. I'm not sure if I was correct, but I thought I might be a bit lean there as this seemed to start after I installed the 300cc bore. But it wasn't horrible and mostly I didn't even notice it but it was definitely there.
My current settings seemed to have solved that problem, but I'm also at 331cc now - I don't know how much that changed they dynamics. My current settings are: #35 pilot, #130 main, N1TC needle @ 3rd clip, fuel screw at 2.0 turns out. I've not had it up over 7K but from 2000 to 7000 RPM all seems well for me with this setup.
#14
10-27-2006, 03:45 AM
RE: Stock vs. N1TC Needle
ORIGINAL: Nobrakes
Bad Bear posted a photo of his Dynojet needed and it's profile might be more what you are looking for. It did not taper smoothly, but dropped from fat to narrow within the span of 1/4 inch or so - very aggressive taper on that needle. Search for "dynojet" by Bad Bear and you'll probably find it - was July or August I think.
But what you describe is similar to what I felt before I changed my CVK settings. Previously, I had #35 pilot, #125 main, N1TC needle @ 2nd clip, fuel screw 2.5 turns out. I noticed what I'd describe as a stuttering - sputtering, not sure the proper turn at low to mid-range throttle settings. But when I opened the throttle, there was no hesitation or bog it just took off like a rocket like you describe. I'm not sure if I was correct, but I thought I might be a bit lean there as this seemed to start after I installed the 300cc bore. But it wasn't horrible and mostly I didn't even notice it but it was definitely there.
My current settings seemed to have solved that problem, but I'm also at 331cc now - I don't know how much that changed they dynamics. My current settings are: #35 pilot, #130 main, N1TC needle @ 3rd clip, fuel screw at 2.0 turns out. I've not had it up over 7K but from 2000 to 7000 RPM all seems well for me with this setup.
Bad Bear posted a photo of his Dynojet needed and it's profile might be more what you are looking for. It did not taper smoothly, but dropped from fat to narrow within the span of 1/4 inch or so - very aggressive taper on that needle. Search for "dynojet" by Bad Bear and you'll probably find it - was July or August I think.
But what you describe is similar to what I felt before I changed my CVK settings. Previously, I had #35 pilot, #125 main, N1TC needle @ 2nd clip, fuel screw 2.5 turns out. I noticed what I'd describe as a stuttering - sputtering, not sure the proper turn at low to mid-range throttle settings. But when I opened the throttle, there was no hesitation or bog it just took off like a rocket like you describe. I'm not sure if I was correct, but I thought I might be a bit lean there as this seemed to start after I installed the 300cc bore. But it wasn't horrible and mostly I didn't even notice it but it was definitely there.
My current settings seemed to have solved that problem, but I'm also at 331cc now - I don't know how much that changed they dynamics. My current settings are: #35 pilot, #130 main, N1TC needle @ 3rd clip, fuel screw at 2.0 turns out. I've not had it up over 7K but from 2000 to 7000 RPM all seems well for me with this setup.
So I put in the N1TC@4 w/128, the bike now acts like it did this summer when the pipe/k&n were installed. Like you described Brian, barely noticeable. I feel better. Now 128 @ 5...or 130 @ 2, the query continues. I want to stay lean as safely possible, so when I run up to 4500ft it still runs well, and I want to keep the 60mpg not the 50 I had before the muzzy/k&n. I'm still favoring the stock needle for the best mpg, I must test everything....pet peave.
#15
10-27-2006, 01:10 PM
RE: Stock vs. N1TC Needle
You guys are great, for a moment I thought someone was going stab somebody with a needle..... jet needle that is.... hahaha, anyway I am crazy and dont understand, I run a 145 at sea level with no lid, stock needle raised 1.25 mm, drilled slide with an inch cut off the slide return spring. See I put a 150 in to start and it was bogging when wacked open so I went down until I got to 145. Runs strong. Buddy of mine tried it he liked it too. I am not saying your settings are wrong, hell kawi put 118 i think can't remember so anything bigger of course is an improvement. Don't dont be afraid to try new stuff. Sometimes it is good to be fat.
#16
10-27-2006, 04:45 PM
RE: Stock vs. N1TC Needle
ORIGINAL: jellyfish
You guys are great, for a moment I thought someone was going stab somebody with a needle..... jet needle that is.... hahaha, anyway I am crazy and dont understand, I run a 145 at sea level with no lid, stock needle raised 1.25 mm, drilled slide with an inch cut off the slide return spring. See I put a 150 in to start and it was bogging when wacked open so I went down until I got to 145. Runs strong. Buddy of mine tried it he liked it too. I am not saying your settings are wrong, hell kawi put 118 i think can't remember so anything bigger of course is an improvement. Don't dont be afraid to try new stuff. Sometimes it is good to be fat.
You guys are great, for a moment I thought someone was going stab somebody with a needle..... jet needle that is.... hahaha, anyway I am crazy and dont understand, I run a 145 at sea level with no lid, stock needle raised 1.25 mm, drilled slide with an inch cut off the slide return spring. See I put a 150 in to start and it was bogging when wacked open so I went down until I got to 145. Runs strong. Buddy of mine tried it he liked it too. I am not saying your settings are wrong, hell kawi put 118 i think can't remember so anything bigger of course is an improvement. Don't dont be afraid to try new stuff. Sometimes it is good to be fat.
Any flat spots in the mid-range? what pipe are you running with? I'll be your gas milage isn't too hot.
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