Plug chops and you.
#14
11-22-2006 | 10:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 21,060
From: Washington
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RE: Plug chops and you.
ORIGINAL: dmar
the stock tool kit with the bike has a tool to take out the plug, with relative ease.
the stock tool kit with the bike has a tool to take out the plug, with relative ease.
Yea that's what I use to get out the plug. Let's see 1/4 turn each flip of the wrench times 14 threads (I hate math by the way) that's 56 flips. Yea that's convienient[:@] Sorry I just felt like complaining, I mean it's in our nature right? What I hate worse is the fact that Kawi dropped the ball on the oil filter change, I mean for another 25 cents they could add a spring onto each filter. Ok I'm done, carry on
#15
11-23-2006 | 12:44 AM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,269
RE: Plug chops and you.
I bought a Bosch O2 sensor to play with and am planning on trying this out. This kind of project is right up my alley so I couldn't resist. The sensor sits in the mid-pipe and produces a voltage that corresponds to the air/fuel mixture. I'll just use one of my microcontroller boards to sense the voltage and produce some sort of usable display - could be as simple as a few LEDs or a little more sophisticated and use an LCD display. But I plan to go one step farther and also use the controller to sense RPMs. With that information, you can record every RPM visited and average the O2 sensor readings to produce the air/fuel vs RPM mixture curve like on that Dynojet report.
The only thing holding me up at this point is actually mounting the sensor. I think I'll take it to an exhaust shop and have them do it - needs drilled and probably some type of nut welded on so the sensor can be screwed in. If I ever want to remove it, I can either just plug up the access hole with a short bolt, or if for some reasone I don't want to do that I can just replace the Muzzy mid-pipe which shouldn't be too expensive.
The only thing holding me up at this point is actually mounting the sensor. I think I'll take it to an exhaust shop and have them do it - needs drilled and probably some type of nut welded on so the sensor can be screwed in. If I ever want to remove it, I can either just plug up the access hole with a short bolt, or if for some reasone I don't want to do that I can just replace the Muzzy mid-pipe which shouldn't be too expensive.
#16
11-23-2006 | 01:57 AM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,262
From: Just South of the Ocala Nationa Forest
RE: Plug chops and you.
Brian,
You might want to take a look here.
It looks like they have a portable "sniffer" they have made up for just what we're trying to do.
Let me know what you think.
I was also looking through their inventory and there are bungs and bung plugs available. You can add the O2 sensor, jet the bike and then plug the hole and use the same head pipe.
Just a thought.
You might want to take a look here.
It looks like they have a portable "sniffer" they have made up for just what we're trying to do.
Let me know what you think.
I was also looking through their inventory and there are bungs and bung plugs available. You can add the O2 sensor, jet the bike and then plug the hole and use the same head pipe.
Just a thought.
#17
11-23-2006 | 02:36 AM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,269
RE: Plug chops and you.
The insert into the pipe looks like it might be a bit unweildy, but I did go ahead and buy the nut and plug. All I need to do is have that welded onto my pipe then I can install remove my O2 sensor when I want to check things out and remove it when I'm done. I was going to do exactly that, but their nut and plug will save me from having to find a match at the hardware store. Hopefully it will weld OK to the Muzzy stainless steel mid-pipe - I'll verify with the exhaust shop before hand to be sure.
Ok, now this next part might sound a bit off the wall, but hey, what can I say, you all know me too well and already know I'm a little off the wall so I'll just go ahead and say it. I've been thinking about what it would take to make an EFI setup. The basics are simple - need a throttle controllable air opening like a regular carburetor, either a butterfly like on the CV carb or the slide on the FCR, an injector, and a controller to sense the mixture and control the injector. It really doesn't sound that complicated. I would love to do this, but ... I only have one bike and this is not the kind of project that you can do in a short time and I don't want to be without a bike for any long period of time. If I had a 2nd bike, I'd be all over this.
So why do this? With electronic fuel injection you continually sense the air/fuel ratio with a high speed microcomputer and based on the current ratio, either command the injector to squirt more or less in order to maintain an optimal burn ratio all the time, regardless of environment factors such as altitude, temperature, etc, as well as bike factors such as airbox lid on / off, exhaust system, etc, etc.
Anyway, this kind of project is also right up my alley so I can hardly resist, but I have to resist unless I buy another bike or maybe I would try it if I could build all the components and get them mostly working before ever installing on the bike. Sounds like a lot of work, but for me that type of thing is what I do for fun anyway, so I'm seriously considering it. So many projects, so little time ...
Ok, now this next part might sound a bit off the wall, but hey, what can I say, you all know me too well and already know I'm a little off the wall so I'll just go ahead and say it. I've been thinking about what it would take to make an EFI setup. The basics are simple - need a throttle controllable air opening like a regular carburetor, either a butterfly like on the CV carb or the slide on the FCR, an injector, and a controller to sense the mixture and control the injector. It really doesn't sound that complicated. I would love to do this, but ... I only have one bike and this is not the kind of project that you can do in a short time and I don't want to be without a bike for any long period of time. If I had a 2nd bike, I'd be all over this.
So why do this? With electronic fuel injection you continually sense the air/fuel ratio with a high speed microcomputer and based on the current ratio, either command the injector to squirt more or less in order to maintain an optimal burn ratio all the time, regardless of environment factors such as altitude, temperature, etc, as well as bike factors such as airbox lid on / off, exhaust system, etc, etc.
Anyway, this kind of project is also right up my alley so I can hardly resist, but I have to resist unless I buy another bike or maybe I would try it if I could build all the components and get them mostly working before ever installing on the bike. Sounds like a lot of work, but for me that type of thing is what I do for fun anyway, so I'm seriously considering it. So many projects, so little time ...
#18
11-23-2006 | 03:04 AM
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,106
From: Misawa Japan
1st Gear Member
RE: Plug chops and you.
Either that or you're a gadget freak like me. C'mon Iowa "live and let live." 
ORIGINAL: Iowaguy
man, you guys worry way too much about your jetting. if it feels right when you ride it then go with it. it's not like we're factory riders around here. i thought i was obsessive, but jeez. you're never gonna get it absolutely 100% perfect, but mine's darn close. by now, it's pretty easy to get a baseline from all the posts on this forum. i'd hate to think that i was so worried about my bike's jetting that i had to hook it up to some computer or do a plug chop on it. just looking at the plug in general will tell you if it's rich or lean.
man, you guys worry way too much about your jetting. if it feels right when you ride it then go with it. it's not like we're factory riders around here. i thought i was obsessive, but jeez. you're never gonna get it absolutely 100% perfect, but mine's darn close. by now, it's pretty easy to get a baseline from all the posts on this forum. i'd hate to think that i was so worried about my bike's jetting that i had to hook it up to some computer or do a plug chop on it. just looking at the plug in general will tell you if it's rich or lean.
#19
11-23-2006 | 03:20 AM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,106
From: Misawa Japan
1st Gear Member
RE: Plug chops and you.
Sounds like a winter project to me. No way I would trade that for riding time. I would definitely use the EFI variety for a motorcyle. I know that some of the older systems in cars were mostly mechanical where an air sensor plate moves in relation to how much air is being allowed to flow through the throttle body at any given time. The air sensor plate is mechanically linked to a fuel metering device. Do the purely electronic versions just pulse the injector on and off more or less freguently to contol fuel flow? I'm not very familiar with those.
ORIGINAL: Nobrakes
The insert into the pipe looks like it might be a bit unweildy, but I did go ahead and buy the nut and plug. All I need to do is have that welded onto my pipe then I can install remove my O2 sensor when I want to check things out and remove it when I'm done. I was going to do exactly that, but their nut and plug will save me from having to find a match at the hardware store. Hopefully it will weld OK to the Muzzy stainless steel mid-pipe - I'll verify with the exhaust shop before hand to be sure.
Ok, now this next part might sound a bit off the wall, but hey, what can I say, you all know me too well and already know I'm a little off the wall so I'll just go ahead and say it. I've been thinking about what it would take to make an EFI setup. The basics are simple - need a throttle controllable air opening like a regular carburetor, either a butterfly like on the CV carb or the slide on the FCR, an injector, and a controller to sense the mixture and control the injector. It really doesn't sound that complicated. I would love to do this, but ... I only have one bike and this is not the kind of project that you can do in a short time and I don't want to be without a bike for any long period of time. If I had a 2nd bike, I'd be all over this.
So why do this? With electronic fuel injection you continually sense the air/fuel ratio with a high speed microcomputer and based on the current ratio, either command the injector to squirt more or less in order to maintain an optimal burn ratio all the time, regardless of environment factors such as altitude, temperature, etc, as well as bike factors such as airbox lid on / off, exhaust system, etc, etc.
Anyway, this kind of project is also right up my alley so I can hardly resist, but I have to resist unless I buy another bike or maybe I would try it if I could build all the components and get them mostly working before ever installing on the bike. Sounds like a lot of work, but for me that type of thing is what I do for fun anyway, so I'm seriously considering it. So many projects, so little time ...
The insert into the pipe looks like it might be a bit unweildy, but I did go ahead and buy the nut and plug. All I need to do is have that welded onto my pipe then I can install remove my O2 sensor when I want to check things out and remove it when I'm done. I was going to do exactly that, but their nut and plug will save me from having to find a match at the hardware store. Hopefully it will weld OK to the Muzzy stainless steel mid-pipe - I'll verify with the exhaust shop before hand to be sure.
Ok, now this next part might sound a bit off the wall, but hey, what can I say, you all know me too well and already know I'm a little off the wall so I'll just go ahead and say it. I've been thinking about what it would take to make an EFI setup. The basics are simple - need a throttle controllable air opening like a regular carburetor, either a butterfly like on the CV carb or the slide on the FCR, an injector, and a controller to sense the mixture and control the injector. It really doesn't sound that complicated. I would love to do this, but ... I only have one bike and this is not the kind of project that you can do in a short time and I don't want to be without a bike for any long period of time. If I had a 2nd bike, I'd be all over this.
So why do this? With electronic fuel injection you continually sense the air/fuel ratio with a high speed microcomputer and based on the current ratio, either command the injector to squirt more or less in order to maintain an optimal burn ratio all the time, regardless of environment factors such as altitude, temperature, etc, as well as bike factors such as airbox lid on / off, exhaust system, etc, etc.
Anyway, this kind of project is also right up my alley so I can hardly resist, but I have to resist unless I buy another bike or maybe I would try it if I could build all the components and get them mostly working before ever installing on the bike. Sounds like a lot of work, but for me that type of thing is what I do for fun anyway, so I'm seriously considering it. So many projects, so little time ...
#20
11-23-2006 | 03:41 AM
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,689
1st Gear Member
RE: Plug chops and you.
For a second bike to experiment with why not go for one of the china bikes on ebay? Heck their motors can be had for $2-$400 for an experimental setup, but then again whole bikes are $500 and up so.... If nothing else it would be a good test bed.