BINGO!

I'll add to it just so you know how nutty I really am.

Webster defines finger tight — adj, made as tight as possible by hand

Using my calibrated lab equipment I was able to messure 10lbs of spring force from the stock auto tensioner in the center of the wear marks.

I made a manual tensioner simulator and was able to measure my personal "finger tight" value at 25lbs. I had to really work at 30lbs, but 25lbs was no problem. That's double the tension on the chain. That can't be good.

I think saying "finger tight" is a bit missleading. I have my manual tensioner set at less than "finger tight". I would say the cold setting should just take out the slop and is less than "finger tight".

Ok, I'll stop now.

 

Impressive! I vote for you as SOTM (Scientist Of The Month)

Seriously, I think like you, I'll even add that I could not find a position where the resistance to screwing increases sharply, like I would have expected if the plunger goes into contact with a non-compressible surface.

It does not mean I don't find the manual adjuster useful. On the contrary. Even though I did not have cam chain noise, Mark convinced me with his posts: the ratchet design is not reliable enough in this application.

 

If you think like me, stay on the meds. They help. It is a great product for sure. I think that if anyone has a UTN (unidentified tapping noise), they should buy this thing. Mine was a faint tapping and I wasn't even sure if it was the tensioner until I took it out. This really is a no brainer if you have a tapping noise. The stock part is real easy to pull out, check, reset, and re-install too. I wish I would have done it sooner. My bike is whisper quiet now. All I hear now is tire tread hitting the pavement.

 

The fact this thread is still alive and filled with debate has kept my mind on my tensioner as I've had to adjust mine a couple of times to quite the noise and I felt like it was requiring more than just fingertight to shut it up. So I pulled it out to have a look. Well the two allen head bolts that hold it in place had loosened on me and it was backing out slowly. I removed it and all looked fine I reinstalled it and put it finger tight and the noise was all better. So I will check it once in a while from now on.

 

And I'll start...

When I'm talking finger tight, I'm not talking how hard you can press with your finger. It is a rotational twisting value, a torque value. When you press down with your finger it is how hard you can press with your arm and body through the tip of your fingler, but when you twist something with your finger tips you can only get so tight and that is less than probably 5 inch/lb. One is a linear force, which the spring is also linear, the other is a rotational force on the bolt in attempt to turn it in. I have no idea what the actual linear force on the bolt might be.

You may note that after you tighten it to as tight as you can get using your fingers, it is being backed off and therefore is less than finger tight, it is actually nearly loose. The key point is getting the play out of the chain, not having actual force on it.

But I will stand by what I said, I am betting there are very few people who could put even as much as 5 inch/lb force on a bolt using their finger tips. Try it, take a torque wrench, tighten a hex bolt with a 13mm head down on a nut in a vise to about 5 inch/lb with an inch/lb torque wrench, then try to loosen it with your fingers. I'm betting you can't do it.

 

Blue hand tool LocTite will do the trick. I will also tell you that the socket head countersunk screws can be tightened to 72 in/lb (actually I use 10.9 grade and they show 84 inch/lb, but I'm playing it safe). That should do the trick.

 

There's more to it though. I don't have the exact formulas, but 5 inch-lbs at the bolt head translates to some axial tension value between the tensioner and the cam chain. Here's a link to what I'm talking about: Bolt Torque Calculator - Engineers Edge Engineering Calculators

If this is the correct formula, then 5 in-lbs on a 5/16" diameter bolt will yield 80 lbs of clamp force. To match the stock spring tension of 10 lbs (that I so accurately measured on my bathroom scale) then all you need is 0.625 in-lbs of torque on the manual adjuster. All I'm trying to say is that "finger tight" can put excessive tension on the cam chain. Again, not sure if this formula is the correct one, but you get the idea.

By the way, loving your product. Just went out on a 100 mile ride this weekend... not a tick. Love it.

 

I used locktite the second time around, difficult to get torqued without pulling the exhaust and I'm lazy. So I hope they won't back out again but I did get some extra noise when it did it so if you think you need to readjust I'd suggest making sure the piece is still tight to the engine.

 

Thanks. I appreciate the fact that it works well.

Key point - I'm betting you can't turn even 1 inch/lb with your finger tips. Try it, take a bolt, turn it into whatever it fits and tighten it to the lowest possible reading you can get, just deflecting the beam on a beam type wrench, then try to loosen the bolt with your finger tips. It ain't gonna happen. If my wrench was in the garage I'd do it, but it's 120 miles away... where my project I need to work on is located.

Also, we are not trying to match the stock spring. The reason for the spring was to advance the ratchet mechanism, noting more. We are just trying to get as close to zero cam chain slack as possible with reasonable efforts. Perfection is zero, I'd rather be just a shade loose than tight. But I doubt the finger tight/back off 1/8-1/4 cold set is off either direction by enough to be concerned. Has to be better than the stuff happening with the stock set up when it goes kaphlooie.

 

You're gonna get me going on this again. I don't have an inch pound wrench. I did some extensive internet research and found the following:

finger tight = 8-10 inch pounds
finger tight + 1/4 turn = 30 inch pounds = 2.5 foot pounds
hand tight = 2 foot pounds
snug = 7 foot pounds

Now I gotta run to Sears to check my personal finger tight and hand tight values...

The stock spring advances the ratchet, but it does apply some force on the chain. As the chain slop grows, the ratchet advances. The tension from the spring is always there (Hooke's law). The ability to have zero tension on the chain makes your product even better than a working stock tensioner IMO.