KLX350SF Cams
#11
08-03-2010 | 03:32 AM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,439
From: Murrieta, Ca
from what i can see, i would say the webs will be fine with the stock springs. depending on the amount of miles you have, maybe just stock replacements would give you peice of mind. i too (once i have a 351 kit) want to get cams to bring the power up a touch higher. while this bike has great torque down low, it strugles to carry that past 8 grand or so, making the stock 10.5 grand useless. when i started (rode quads before, this is my first bike), the power band worked well (ran a purple one 
), but now im a lot better and basicly race the bike and i would like some "over rev" area as they call it, or the ablity to leave it in a gear and let is sing for those moments where shifting is almost pointless (corner approching, hill climbs, ect., maybe green power band?). when/if i get the big bore, im going to talk to bill for a while on a reliable race set up, been dreaming of a 351 with full head job, cams, carb, and 30 hp atleast. almost thinking after market rod to help drop some vibration and lighten the rotating mass a touch.
), but now im a lot better and basicly race the bike and i would like some "over rev" area as they call it, or the ablity to leave it in a gear and let is sing for those moments where shifting is almost pointless (corner approching, hill climbs, ect., maybe green power band?). when/if i get the big bore, im going to talk to bill for a while on a reliable race set up, been dreaming of a 351 with full head job, cams, carb, and 30 hp atleast. almost thinking after market rod to help drop some vibration and lighten the rotating mass a touch.
Last edited by punkenduro09; 08-03-2010 at 03:34 AM.
#13
08-03-2010 | 11:54 AM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,106
From: Misawa Japan
1st Gear Member
I'm in search for cams for my KLX350SF (D-Tracker). Bill's bore kit provides great torque, yet, in essence, the engine still feels like a KLX250. I just want more horsepower for rickety rocket ***-sliding corner burning apex blocking power... at the smartest price.
Before any get another bike post, here's why it needs to be a KLX350. It stays within the local track regulation that allows any modification as long as I use the stock crank case. There enters the search more power from the KLX350SF.
The current engine set-up is B&B 350 kit, FCR39 open carb with filter and split intake bell, ported head, older model KLX-SR CDI (for more advance), RSV headpipe, CRF dual exhaust, and AI blockoff.
The current chasis setup is supermotard with alloy rims, reworked suspension, 4 piston caliper, and Brembo radial brakemaster 18x16.
Considering the above, more HP up top is needed and within 11,500RPMS so I am leaning toward using Webcam grind #55 (for the KLX300). Webcams say I need stronger valve springs but the Yoshimura has more lift and everybody that use Yoshis say no valve adjustments or stiffer springs are needed.
I don't want to use stronger springs because the valves slap back harder and decrease their life... maybe blow the motor. Yoshimura says using stock springs with their cams is good-to-go.
Here are the cam specifics.
YOSHIMURA SP-1 Race cams: Installation is Drop-in Bolt-on, Valve Lift is IN8.80mm EX9.20mm, Duration at 0.05" is IN234 EX238
WEBCAMS grind #55 for KLX300R (interchangeble with KLX250)
Installation according to Webcams says stiffer springs required, Valve Lift is IN8.94mm EX8.94mm, Duration at 0.05" is IN243 EX243
Webcam grind 55 with the overlap looks so good for absolute top end while the Yoshimuras look so sophisticated and calculated with the different IN and EX cam dimensions for a balance of top end power and reliablity with stock springs...
The question is, what do you guys think about using the Webcam grind number 55 with stock springs? I just need some thoughts or hindsight to help me with my choice....
Before any get another bike post, here's why it needs to be a KLX350. It stays within the local track regulation that allows any modification as long as I use the stock crank case. There enters the search more power from the KLX350SF.
The current engine set-up is B&B 350 kit, FCR39 open carb with filter and split intake bell, ported head, older model KLX-SR CDI (for more advance), RSV headpipe, CRF dual exhaust, and AI blockoff.
The current chasis setup is supermotard with alloy rims, reworked suspension, 4 piston caliper, and Brembo radial brakemaster 18x16.
Considering the above, more HP up top is needed and within 11,500RPMS so I am leaning toward using Webcam grind #55 (for the KLX300). Webcams say I need stronger valve springs but the Yoshimura has more lift and everybody that use Yoshis say no valve adjustments or stiffer springs are needed.
I don't want to use stronger springs because the valves slap back harder and decrease their life... maybe blow the motor. Yoshimura says using stock springs with their cams is good-to-go.
Here are the cam specifics.
YOSHIMURA SP-1 Race cams: Installation is Drop-in Bolt-on, Valve Lift is IN8.80mm EX9.20mm, Duration at 0.05" is IN234 EX238
WEBCAMS grind #55 for KLX300R (interchangeble with KLX250)
Installation according to Webcams says stiffer springs required, Valve Lift is IN8.94mm EX8.94mm, Duration at 0.05" is IN243 EX243
Webcam grind 55 with the overlap looks so good for absolute top end while the Yoshimuras look so sophisticated and calculated with the different IN and EX cam dimensions for a balance of top end power and reliablity with stock springs...
The question is, what do you guys think about using the Webcam grind number 55 with stock springs? I just need some thoughts or hindsight to help me with my choice....
I guess half the fun is the journey though. I'll be following your results, but I've seen this story play-out quite a few times.
My recommedation is KTM, Husky or a Motarded MX Japanese bike.
#14
08-03-2010 | 12:00 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 165
I have a set of the web #101 grind cams with the 351BB, ported, delta pipe and larger carb.
HP and torque start dropping of after 8000rpm, so you will need a larger cam than that to see 11,000 and still make power.
Stop teasing and post some pixs of that badazz bike of yours!
HP and torque start dropping of after 8000rpm, so you will need a larger cam than that to see 11,000 and still make power.
Stop teasing and post some pixs of that badazz bike of yours!
#16
08-03-2010 | 08:34 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 42
From: Okinawa, Japan
Thanks for all the great responses,
What I think of the bike now:
The KLX350 is a dream, a hot and take-your-breath-away kind of dream, literally. It starts with a tight wet cylinder, a big bulging piston and a situation ready to explode... then you find a really strong plastic bag over you head and it becomes hot, humid, and suffocating. Some people may like that but I need more air....
The 350 does as advertised, delivers as supposed to performs better than any other kit till it just dies at 7000 when the rush is supposed to start happening! This thing needs cams, something never seen before on a KLX250 kind of size. Or else, it looks like the best option now is grind 55.
And a little about myself:
I wrote in the first post not to tell me to get another bike....I started with different bikes, and went through 150mph corners on knee with R1s and GSXR1000. I still have my fully kitted 2003 Aprilia RS250s to shame liter bikes or KTMs. It's a rainbow scheme full-power 2stroker 250cc that runs circles around big mean bikes (like this). Nothing can touch the times 2strokers make except another 2 stroker, a MotoGP 2stroker, or 125cc mini 2stroker replica, or another 2 stroker. Furthermore, my wife rips new buttholes on motard riders with her 150hp CBR929RR. Moreover, blah blah friggen blah so suck it, don't need another bike. I need some real cams for this KLX!
And for the genuinely concerned, I already have another 350kit motor on the side so I accept what consequences may come from the test motor. The 350kit is new technology on a 15year old engine. Going as cheap as possible, I think a tried and tested 350bore + 350 specific cam combo kit, a FCR37MX from Ebay, and a full exhaust would be around $1500.
So Finally:
Given a healthy head, what do you think the maximum horsepower BOLT-ON cam profile would be?
And please post an answer if you like healthy heads
What I think of the bike now:
The KLX350 is a dream, a hot and take-your-breath-away kind of dream, literally. It starts with a tight wet cylinder, a big bulging piston and a situation ready to explode... then you find a really strong plastic bag over you head and it becomes hot, humid, and suffocating. Some people may like that but I need more air....
The 350 does as advertised, delivers as supposed to performs better than any other kit till it just dies at 7000 when the rush is supposed to start happening! This thing needs cams, something never seen before on a KLX250 kind of size. Or else, it looks like the best option now is grind 55.
And a little about myself:
I wrote in the first post not to tell me to get another bike....I started with different bikes, and went through 150mph corners on knee with R1s and GSXR1000. I still have my fully kitted 2003 Aprilia RS250s to shame liter bikes or KTMs. It's a rainbow scheme full-power 2stroker 250cc that runs circles around big mean bikes (like this). Nothing can touch the times 2strokers make except another 2 stroker, a MotoGP 2stroker, or 125cc mini 2stroker replica, or another 2 stroker. Furthermore, my wife rips new buttholes on motard riders with her 150hp CBR929RR. Moreover, blah blah friggen blah so suck it, don't need another bike. I need some real cams for this KLX!
And for the genuinely concerned, I already have another 350kit motor on the side so I accept what consequences may come from the test motor. The 350kit is new technology on a 15year old engine. Going as cheap as possible, I think a tried and tested 350bore + 350 specific cam combo kit, a FCR37MX from Ebay, and a full exhaust would be around $1500.
So Finally:
Given a healthy head, what do you think the maximum horsepower BOLT-ON cam profile would be?
And please post an answer if you like healthy heads
Last edited by japanbilly; 08-03-2010 at 09:11 PM. Reason: added some info, fixed some grammatical errors
#17
08-04-2010 | 01:50 AM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,439
From: Murrieta, Ca
. nice bike by the way, very original with the crf250 set up.
#18
08-04-2010 | 02:04 AM
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,106
From: Misawa Japan
1st Gear Member
Thanks for all the great responses,
What I think of the bike now:
The KLX350 is a dream, a hot and take-your-breath-away kind of dream, literally. It starts with a tight wet cylinder, a big bulging piston and a situation ready to explode... then you find a really strong plastic bag over you head and it becomes hot, humid, and suffocating. Some people may like that but I need more air....
The 350 does as advertised, delivers as supposed to performs better than any other kit till it just dies at 7000 when the rush is supposed to start happening! This thing needs cams, something never seen before on a KLX250 kind of size. Or else, it looks like the best option now is grind 55.
And a little about myself:
I wrote in the first post not to tell me to get another bike....I started with different bikes, and went through 150mph corners on knee with R1s and GSXR1000. I still have my fully kitted 2003 Aprilia RS250s to shame liter bikes or KTMs. It's a rainbow scheme full-power 2stroker 250cc that runs circles around big mean bikes (like this). Nothing can touch the times 2strokers make except another 2 stroker, a MotoGP 2stroker, or 125cc mini 2stroker replica, or another 2 stroker. Furthermore, my wife rips new buttholes on motard riders with her 150hp CBR929RR. Moreover, blah blah friggen blah so suck it, don't need another bike. I need some real cams for this KLX!
And for the genuinely concerned, I already have another 350kit motor on the side so I accept what consequences may come from the test motor. The 350kit is new technology on a 15year old engine. Going as cheap as possible, I think a tried and tested 350bore + 350 specific cam combo kit, a FCR37MX from Ebay, and a full exhaust would be around $1500.
So Finally:
Given a healthy head, what do you think the maximum horsepower BOLT-ON cam profile would be?
And please post an answer if you like healthy heads
What I think of the bike now:
The KLX350 is a dream, a hot and take-your-breath-away kind of dream, literally. It starts with a tight wet cylinder, a big bulging piston and a situation ready to explode... then you find a really strong plastic bag over you head and it becomes hot, humid, and suffocating. Some people may like that but I need more air....
The 350 does as advertised, delivers as supposed to performs better than any other kit till it just dies at 7000 when the rush is supposed to start happening! This thing needs cams, something never seen before on a KLX250 kind of size. Or else, it looks like the best option now is grind 55.
And a little about myself:
I wrote in the first post not to tell me to get another bike....I started with different bikes, and went through 150mph corners on knee with R1s and GSXR1000. I still have my fully kitted 2003 Aprilia RS250s to shame liter bikes or KTMs. It's a rainbow scheme full-power 2stroker 250cc that runs circles around big mean bikes (like this). Nothing can touch the times 2strokers make except another 2 stroker, a MotoGP 2stroker, or 125cc mini 2stroker replica, or another 2 stroker. Furthermore, my wife rips new buttholes on motard riders with her 150hp CBR929RR. Moreover, blah blah friggen blah so suck it, don't need another bike. I need some real cams for this KLX!
And for the genuinely concerned, I already have another 350kit motor on the side so I accept what consequences may come from the test motor. The 350kit is new technology on a 15year old engine. Going as cheap as possible, I think a tried and tested 350bore + 350 specific cam combo kit, a FCR37MX from Ebay, and a full exhaust would be around $1500.
So Finally:
Given a healthy head, what do you think the maximum horsepower BOLT-ON cam profile would be?
And please post an answer if you like healthy heads
I own a KLX and love the bike, so I'm not hating on it! Nice bike, BTW! One of the better ones I've seen. I've never seen a HP peak above 8K on the KLX or D-tracker with bolt-on mod's alone and NO cam is going to get you much past that by itself, much less 11K with current engine internals....IMHO! Prove me wrong and you get a cookie or maybe some nama beer with a healthy HEAD of foam
The power peak actually tapers sooner when you go large bore.I've seen a KLX with the power curve you describe, but it had a knife-edged and stroked crankshaft, stronger con. rod, port and chamber and valve work, behive valve springs...the list goes-on and it wasn't cheap by any means. Anyway, you have a challenge before you, but I wish you success.
P.S. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah freakin blah...
#19
08-04-2010 | 07:26 AM
Thread Starter
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Member
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 42
From: Okinawa, Japan
Yea, it is a challenge to make that old KLX head breath like a modern 250cc engines but my mission is simple. To find bolt-on cams designed specifically for the KLX350 with as much flow as possible... and I just sent 3 cam cores to Bill Blue for a new design.
I appreciate it if anybody has any suggestions before all three cams are made ... punkeduro?
#20
08-04-2010 | 09:54 AM
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,106
From: Misawa Japan
1st Gear Member
I'll take that nama beer (Ice-cold tap beer in an ice-cold mug in English)!
Yea, it is a challenge to make that old KLX head breath like a modern 250cc engines but my mission is simple. To find bolt-on cams designed specifically for the KLX350 with as much flow as possible... and I just sent 3 cam cores to Bill Blue for a new design.
I appreciate it if anybody has any suggestions before all three cams are made ... punkeduro?
Yea, it is a challenge to make that old KLX head breath like a modern 250cc engines but my mission is simple. To find bolt-on cams designed specifically for the KLX350 with as much flow as possible... and I just sent 3 cam cores to Bill Blue for a new design.
I appreciate it if anybody has any suggestions before all three cams are made ... punkeduro?
Jerry leighton at http://fourstrokeworks.biz/ 760-948-0325 has forgotten more about the KLX than most of us know. He'll talk your ear off for free. I use Skype Out from Japan to call stateside, not sure if you've got the same thing. Jerry used to work for Stroker Performance back when Larry Roeseler raced the KLX in enduros. He also performs cam re-grinds and I'm sure he has plenty of sources for head work. Is that what you meant by a 'healthy head' ? LOL!
I'm running a direct BMC filter and have a catch tank mounted to the front of what used to be the air box. Are you using something similar?
Last edited by tremor38; 08-04-2010 at 10:02 AM.