B58, interesting comment on the HR monitor and effort. In the bicycle world this has been noted in a lot of mountainbiking scenarios where hardtail vs. full suspension debates occur. Unless excessive weight of the given bike was a major issue, the full suspension bike would usually yield faster lap times with less effort for the rider...an HR readout being one of the parameters. However, this was not true for mountainbikers in the Red Bull Rampage events where they literally jump off of cliffs and actually survive half the time. They found that no HR monitor could survive the explosive heartrates yielded by the riders as they experienced sheer terror during the event...LOL!

While we differ a bit on some of the issues of spring effect on the KLX, there's no doubt that we agree on good valving. I try to temper my responses about how the RT Gold Valve job has ended up working out on my KLX with terms like "bordering on amazing" and "almost amazing"...but frankly it's pretty darned just flat amazing. I was riding this weekend out at our club's riding place, and it's a rocky, ledgy, rough place. It has the notariety of usually being rated as the toughest enduro on our state's yearly enduro circuit. It's always a hoot to ride my revalved KLX out there, as the harsh performance it had a year ago is still fresh on my mind. Having done both ends of the bike with revalving and different springs, it's a whole different bike by a large margin.

 

I have been to most of the suspension web sites and read all I can. I do believe in the case of too soft of a spring giving a harsh ride because the compression valving. A stiffer spring makes the valve have less to do so the bike FEELS and is softer.

I ended up ordering the moto pro valve kit for the front of my SF. It will be here in a week or so.

As far as the fork springs on the SF the guy from moto pro said don't change them because they are already too stiff for my weight. I investagated and it seems he is right.

David

I can't ride becasue sub freezing temps and snow. All I can do is talk about it and work on it.

 

Want to swap springs? Will yours work in an '09 250S?

 

Yep, and yep.

We have some differences of opinion on spring effects, at least partly because I'm a totally self-taught NOOB regarding suspension. I've only tweaked suspensions on a grand total of 7 bikes in my lifetime, only four of those (which I listed previously) were dirt-oriented. I did get to do Beta testing on some Inertia-valves that RICOR makes, mostly because I was NOT a suspension expert, just a decent dual-sport rider, with few pre-conceived notions about suspension. I simply got to ride whatever product(s) they had on the bike that day, and compare it to my bike....which wasn't even stock at that time.

So, I developed some of my own testing, to back up what I was feeling....because feelings can lie. For example: overly stiff suspensions can FEEL faster, partly because of the high-frequency jarring, partly because you have less control. A timed course while wearing a HR monitor was the simplest way I could determine, express, plot on a graft, and explain.

However, readers must take more experienced people's advice (like TNC) over mine, as I am NOT an authority on suspensions. I should have made that clear from the very beginning, as I know my writing can sometimes appear to be done by someone with much more experience than I have.

Here's an example of how I don't know about suspensions. A friend had their suspension re-done and we went riding. I noticed the rear end was hopping high and to the side over whoops...they noticed the same thing. I thought it must be too quick on the rear rebound, but, said: Let's ask the expert that built it prior to messing around with it. The builder said, slow the rebound on the front 2 clicks. We did, it turned out perfectly. The bike was immediately taking the same whoops in a neutral stance instead of the having the rear kicking around. (I won't go into the reasons, as I understand them, that this worked, because that would seem like I'm trying to be an expert, which I am not.)

So, while I have limited experience on a few bikes, I'm not an expert by any means. The few I have experience upon, I already wrote about what they did under my seat....but, that's obviously not a lot of different bikes.

 

Quote: Blackheart58: However, readers must take more experienced people's advice (like TNC) over mine, as I am NOT an authority on suspensions. I should have made that clear from the very beginning, as I know my writing can sometimes appear to be done by someone with much more experience than I have.

LOL!...Hey man, I'm not sure what a "suspension authority" is, but if I was one, I'd be working for myself or somebody else doing it for a living.

And the minute you think you are one, somebody puts you in your place with more knowledge, more experience, and better comprehension. I think most of us come to these forums because we want to share our enthusiasm with others. We all have plenty to share and more to learn.

 

How big of a job is it to change out the valve parts? I think I'll do the front forks now and see if the shock could use it too and maybe get it once the bike parts fund gets replenished.

 

You know what? Before the internet, we were all happy with what we had. It wasn't until the internet came along did we learn that all our stuff really wasn't so great and what we really needed to do was spend more money on stuff.

 

No thank you,

According to race tech spring calculator, my stock front springs are 1.1 kg/mm and I NEED .47 kg/mm

Is also says my rear is a 6.8 and I NEED a 7.1 for my weight.

Look em up, its a free internet. Here

http://old.racetech.com/evalving/Spr...ork&bikeid=582

David

 

Like most things mechanical, it's simple and easy to some, nearly impossible for others! I didn't do my own, as the builder had no experience on an 09, and wanted to do some testing with mine. In exchange for him using mine as a test-bed, he only charged me with what I ended up with.

I'm going to say it's similar in skill demands as swapping over to a Big Bore...which seemed easy to me. The hardest part was the wrist-pin circlip. I don't know the reciprocal circlip step on the Fork swap-out.

Just follow the manual directions, be deliberate in remembering what bolt/washer/fastener goes where, and take pictures if that helps. Use good replacement oil as well as a decent torque wrench on re-assembly. If you've never messed with fork seals before, a single sheet of cellophane covering the fork tube helps keep the wiper and oil seal from getting cut by the tube edge on reassembly....its those kind of instructions that decrease mistakes. But, there are only two ways to get that experience: from someone that has done it, or, by doing it yourself.

If you are sure about what parts are required (by getting that information from someone that knows what they are talking about...like John at MotoPro), I'd always encourage people to do it themselves, if they have decent mechanical skills, or want to develop those skills. Machine-work? Take it to a shop. Replacing things like fork valves...that's within the garage mechanic realm.

 

FD, for me the hardest or most technical part was removing the peening at the bolt and end of the compression damping unit. And by that I mean that it is a step that doesn't just involve unbolting and bolting parts together...but it wasn't hard. A simple flat hand file was all that was needed. The neat thing with the RT system is that they also send an extensive DVD along with the written instructions. Paul Thede is the RT guru who walks you through the whole process on the DVD. The DVD is an awesome tutorial about how the fork or shock works even if one wasn't doing the work...one DVD for each component. I've seen the Moto Pro parts kit, and it looks quite similar to RT's and probably every bit as good. However, if Moto Pro doesn't also offer a DVD along with their instructions, that would be enough for me to go with RT. On the other hand if were sending the components out to be done, I'd probably have John at Moto Pro do it. For a home mechanic who's not been highly involved with shim stacking techniques and the internal componentry of a fork and shock, the DVD is worth having.

There are two special tools required for working on the fork. One is the damper cylinder holding tool, and the other is the seal driver. I made a cylinder holding tool out of a 30mm (or so) aluminum seatpost from a bicycle...using a hacksaw and file. People have installed seals with punches, wood dowels, and other techniques for a long time, but it's also easy to walk your assembled fork to moto shop and have them tap the seals in with the appropriate seal driver for very little money.

As far as the rear shock is concerned, frankly I think it's easier to work on than the fork. It's simpler and doesn't require any serious special tools. The nitrogen charge is the last thing you do, and that's a dirt cheap step at any decent moto shop.